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Thread: Straight From My Heart........

  1. #1
    Axerider
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    Default Straight From My Heart........

    Dear WILD Alphas

    I find myself writing this because I feel like I should, and also because in all of this mess, I feel as if you have forgotten how the rest of us might feel. I chose to address the WILD alphas alone because I could care less of what the RED alphas say or do, I am not RED, I am WILD. Thus far, what I have said on this forum, I chose to do so not as a WILD alone, but as any member caught in between a whirlpool of events leading to this. I chose to see both the WILD side of the story, and the RED side too. I tried to be as least biased as possible, none of you are innocent, but I'll be harder on the WILD alphas because I expected so much more from you. Remember Cali?What I'd said to you? I was proud of how WILD leaders conducted themselves on this forum before all this began. I was silently boastful, I said to you. I'm not sure if I feel the same way anymore. It hurts.

    I find myself saying all this with a saddened heart. I do not expect you to understand anymore, if you haven't yet, you may never. You as WILD alphas, I apologize. I have expected too much from you. I put you on the highest pedestal, I am the only one to blame for that. You are only human. That does not make me feel any better though, and I continue to grind you harder, because you are my leaders, my expectations were higher.

    There are a few things I would like to address. Thus far on the forum, regardless of what the RED alphas have said and done, it was expected of. No surprise there. They have been arrogant from day one. You have been sensible until now. You continue to point fingers at each other, saying who is the worse of the two. In reality you're no better then them. No.. maybe you are. At least you haven't abandoned us. However, you continue to justify your actions, or at least sound as if you are. Not once has anyone of you shown any remorse for what has happened to everyone else involved.. No one has come out officially saying they were sorry to the people that felt betrayed by your actions.
    There is an ego trip on this forum, its not very difficult to see. The worst part out of all this is you speak as if betrayal by RED was unacceptable, yet you chose to betray your own members? How could you think it was ok to lie to our faces? You did lie. Remember the time Fleg asked who NMIGN was on the forum, or if he was a WILD. 2 alphas, Cali and Ceril, in front of everyone, said he wasn't a WILD?! All that time he was? Lies.
    Ceril, you said RED betrayed us, therefore we could not trust them. How can we trust you then? How do we know what you say is true? This secret deal, does anybody realize who came out on top? RED members had a right to know who was making their decisions, even concerning the cropper disputes. The people we thought were our enemies, our leaders? Do you realize how betrayed we feel, yet you speak of RED betraying us? Do you realize how insulting it feels to be treated this way?

    When I say this next thing, I say it out of a very honest heart. I feel sorry for the RED members more then I do for myself and the other WILD members. In all of this conflict, regardless, the RED members are left to fight a battle, while the people responsible for such a wager have fled the scene long before. Where is the justice in that?

    Your intentions were good. I respect you for that. What you tried to do in the beginning, despite a lot of people not liking it, had it been open, it would have been more acceptable than keeping it a secret.

    Alphas, no one is innocent in all of this. No one expects you to be right all the time. Coming on the forum, pointing fingers and trying to justify your actions only hurts that much more. Have you forgotten that we're the ones being pounded? RED and WILD members? Because of your secrets? Do you realize how insulting it feels when you think it is ok to treat people this way? How would you like it if one day you were to find out that the United States was actually under the Russian government and everything was decided for you by the Russian government, and all this time you did not know?.. and all this time you hated the Russian government..? (Just an example, not meant to insult either governments). Again I do not care for the RED alphas, therefore I choose not to acknowledge them in all this.

    One more thing. Having to justify what I say on the forum to you via PM or skype is exhausting. Please do me the kindness and let me not have to explain myself to you all over and over again. My post is how I feel. It should be enough.

    Please note that I am not writing this out of hate, nor am I looking for sympathy. I just thought you should know that what you've done to us is nothing less then what you'd call betrayal, and I doubt I am alone in feeling this way. My intentions are not to hurt nor embarrass you, but only to enlighten you on how the people caught in between may feel due to your actions. I thought it important that you know that, and your justifications of such an action only leaves the wound to grow deeper.
    I saw weird stuff in that place last night. Weird, strange, sick, twisted, eerie, godless, evil stuff... and I want in.

  2. #2
    Guardsman girasoul's Avatar
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    Dear Hsarp,

    Im sincerely sorry our choices and what we've done have caused you so much pain and anguish. Its late tonight already, and Im too exhausted to do your post justice atm. I've read it though, and I will do my best to answer you tomorrow at length.

    Girasoul

  3. #3
    Natarian Knight wishmaster3's Avatar
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    that was probably the most sensible post in this whole forum.

    I can only imagine what it feels like, but I know I wouldn't feel good about it either. If I was in WILD I would probably feel just as huge an urge to delete my account as if I was in RED, getting my account destroyed.

    I think it's a result of this huge meta coming to a server; it would be a real dissapointment loosing, so they have to guard themselves against that to such an extent so they, well, have a hand in almost every quad before the server even starts. when it ends up in a server with no real competitors like this, the whole act of securing themselves just becomes so ridicolous.

    Animis opibusque parati
    Latest server: SGC @ com1 - http://i.imgur.com/PDGiaoa.jpg | Current: Retired

  4. #4

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    This is bit pointless...

    I don't thin that there is much disapointment among Wild members regarding keeping RED as SECRET wing..this is stuff of politics and leaders always have to keep some things in reserve, any player that has played in good alliances knows that thats how things go in travian politics ...

    Only thing dissapointing about it all is that RED actually was Wild wing...when I personally found out about it I was very dissapointed since I considered RED only possible worthy opponent on server, since server at that point evolved enough to see who is who..

    I actually hoped for RED/IP and BLACK merger before it happened and hoped for such war.

    After I found out the truth I said to myself that nothing will be able to get my interest back short of RED/BLACK/IP war...in those days it was still on scale wheter RED can be trusted or not.

    Fortunately for this server my hopes came true, and war started. Personally I think best thing for this server. Cause lets be real Wild/RED/BLACK in ally would be done deal for this server.

    Unfortunately war was dissapointing, well to be more precise RED/BLACK/IP was dissapointing as their showed incredible lack of organization and teamwork. The fact that Wild walked over them and war turned out that way isn't Wild's fault, it was right decision no matter what motives were behind it. RED/BLACK/IP inefficeincy lies on their backs only. And there is no place to excuses, or complaints directed in Wild's way.

    With all hammers seen from that side its inccorect to say balance of strength was overwhelmingly on Wild side...completely uncorrect. Size of hammers seen was truly incredible, and their number also wasn't to be neglected. With more coordination this war could have been most interesting thing this server could have offered...but RED/BLACK/IP failed...for alliances that bragged about their aggresive play they looked like team collected on street and pushed to play against top NBA team. You don't expect that from alliances that were independednt of each other for most of server and had plenty of time to build their cohesivnes and teamplay in their fights with their quad opponents.

    Wild came here with RED as wing...5 wings at early stage is a fail in my book. But lets be real what did it really mean in following events.

    1. Wild and RED have never taken joined actions, most of cooperation possible was info sharing, but considering that Wild had no role in NE, we can exclude even that, so it comes to that it was ally on paper only

    2. RED claims Wild pushed them in zerging the NE, by accepting BLACK and I believe one of RED leaders said by recruiting top of KING, I won't go in whose initiative was it, as its irrelevant. But once again what does it truly mean

    From one perspective Wild pushed RED to become stronger, BLACK on their side doubled their numbers, best KING can offer aswell...so it turns out RED is complaining that Wild made them stronger. These are actually steps most alliances take in their quad domination. Only time is the issue here.

    Question for RED, you seemed to be anti zerg, so do say if you haven't came here as Wild wing, if you were independent would you do anything diffrently?

    Second perspective is that it was RED's initiative. Same conclusions, RED became stronger, BLACK+KING+IP made formidable coalition.

    3. Some RED members came here complaining that Wild is zerg, that Wild betrayed RED. Isn't this contradictory? If RED claims are true, then I would agree, Wild + RED + BLACK is zergish, and looking at balace of strength on server it would be the end.

    What has Wild done then? Instead of make such coalition Wild has decided to fight it. Completely non-zergish action. Action that could have saved this server from complete boredome, if RED/BLACK/IP pulled their weight instead of rolled over and dropped dead. But still even if in this war Wild wooped their ***, it gave opportunity for SWAT+Lords coalition to grow in numbers and strength.

    If the claim is in regard to Wild's current numbers, then no. By mere definition of zerg, Wild certainly isn't it.

    Question for RED. What are you actually complaining about? Wild "betraying" you or Wild being zerg?

    As you can see its contradictory, if you complain WIld is betraying you, then you would prefer that confed remained, and IP joined it aswell. Those are zergish notions. If you are complaining WIld is zerg then why do you complain about Wild going to war with you.

    On the side this war's outcome, RED/BLACK/IP was still second force on this server after Wild, at the moment decision was made.

    4. RED claims they did Wild dirty work, lets be real with all due respect to ex-KING, and i truly have alot of sympathy for sever made alliances, but in reality KING's strength would be in length with Lords.

    RED approached NE as any alliance would, clean and dominate. As was said in earlier threads Wild actually made NE stronger, by giving them more experienced leadership team, someone to collect the best and unite them under the same flag. So to claim RED did Wild's work is uncorrect. Strength of NE wouln't have been any greater without RED in comparition with coalition RED has assembled. Not to mention that Wild be even stronger if RED joined them in NW.

    So to put some facts.

    1. Wild alphas weren't confident in Wild's strength enough so they decided for secret wing. Wrong decision, I hope lesson learned. Wild is one of best alliances travian can offer so this kind of plays are truly unnecesary.

    2. Wild's alphas had zergish notions with setting up their NE allies, BUT their actions and following events are certainly not zergish, and you can say it was the right way to redemption.

    3. Who betrayed whom, I will go with Ceril and agree blame lies on both sides. Wild didn't start with notion to betray RED in the future, RED agreed to come as Wild wing but they evidently didn't comprehend what it means and acted as Wild's confed with independent ally. Both sides are under influence of story from their own leaders so they back up that story. Truth is as was said, their is blame on both sides. Truth is also that war is best thing that happened for this server.

    4. Server had very low quality, Wild in NW being only elite alliance here. RED with their small group in NW, IP in SE. SWAT mediocre alliance, that has evident leadership and organization problems in SW. This resulted in Wild having most concentration of talent added with most experienced leadership team.

    5. Low server quality isn't Wild's fault. The fact that NE didn't have enough quality to wipe small party of RED players landing there isn't Wild's fault. The fact that IP refused to help SE shape itself and help them with their experience to try form more formidable alliance isn't Wild's fault. The fact that SWAT showed lack of organization isn't Wild's fault. The fact that RED/BLACK/IP war was one sided, well yes its partly Wild's fault, Wild showed that they are up to their name and that they can back their words, RED/IP/BLACK showed nothing of that and thats the blame of their leaders.

    6. Is server over? No it isn't...its true that SWAT and Lords aren't what you can call elite alliances. But by joining hands, and Wild's distraction with RED/IP/BLACK they got the chance to simm, grow, develope and organize, why Wild on other side depleted their deff reserves and altouugh not much lost some of their off power. Their numbers are currently 3:1 compared to Wild, if you take that some RED/BLACK/IP are are still fighting it makes it even bigger diffrence. So I say no, server isn't over, SWAT has a decent chance, they got the time to sort their ranks, now time will tell what they have to offer.

  5. #5
    Caliban
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    I am tired of you and your high horse hsarp. For all your expectations and lamentations you don't put any extra effort into making WILD what it is. You don't contribute in any way to the officer corp or helping our alliance rise above the others. So it is just the slightest bit annoying to see you crap on the work and intentions of the people who give more to this alliance everyday than you will during an entire server.

    Things are pretty simple here. If you feel betrayed quit the team. I wouldn't stick around with a team I felt betrayed me. And I am very quick to throw out those who I believe have betrayed me (See Lynx & RED). But maybe I am taking you too literally... maybe instead of the "Alphas Betrayed Me" song you are singing what you really meant to sing was... "If I were an Alpha here is how I would have done things differently". Again there is a very simple solution to that problem. If you want to make sure your alliance adheres to all your own personal quirks and expectations.... FORM YOUR OWN ALLIANCE and play well enough to have people want to play with you. It's not some hidden secret. You may wish to try it in the future. After all, it is how I got around to being one of the co-founders of the WILD.

    Until you do that, you can stuff all this talk of betrayal. No one ever promised you that the WILD would do no diplomacy. No one ever promised you that we would not have classified information. We never posted on our page drivel about "no alliances, no diplomacy, no metas" type stuff. But you still say you were betrayed. To be betrayed you need to be deceived. Despite all your protestations no one in leadership ever deceived you. You may have been disappointed, hoping that we would war RED only later to find out we were allies, but in that case it is ridiculous to claim that it is leadership's role to make sure the expectations of every single member are fulfilled.

    Guess what.... lots of people have lots of different expectations. As leadership it is our job to make the hard decisions knowing full well that no matter what we do, there will be a hsarp claiming we are foolish, malicious, or both. But that is of no consequence since, if we fill our roles well, then the ultimate judge of our leadership will be the number of players who enjoyed their run and want to join us on another server.

    As for RED members, why feel sorry for them? They had bad leaders... that isn't an uncommon thing in travian... and you yourself claim to be the victim of bad leadership. None of the RED/BLACK rank and file members were playing with any reasonable expectation that they were members of the WILD. The few who did know actively worked to sabotage that link. Do you think the former Lords and former IP guys were doing backflips about the quality of their leadership? At least you have a leadership around to throw your insults at. It seems your main bit of bad luck was not joining SWAT, since according to your standards they are the only worthy leadership on this server.

    So if you are waiting for an apology... continue waiting. At every point of this server I have made decisions that I thought were the best for my team and I continue to do so. You can continue to second-guess us from your seat of zero-responsibility. Despite the wrongheadedness of your posts, I still consider you a member in good standing


    P.S. When we said NMIGN was not WILD we believed it. We did not know who he was, and he did not share that information at the time (preferring to bash WILD from behind a useful mask I guess.... see what I mean when I say that they had been undermining since the beginning?). But according to you we are liars. And to me that is the perfect encapsulation of what can be expected from you. So keep making half-cocked accusations with little to none of the backstory and relevant information... it's what you do best.

  6. #6

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    I totally agree with dreamworld well on most parts, what most ppl fail to see is that the alphas took something that real kings and rulers have done since the beginning, persia did it, greece did it, rome did it even us is doing it, make sure they stay the strongest by making sure they know everything and pulling the strings and chose the right time to go to war against someone.

    Sure the alphas went a little extreme but most elite alliances play like this, why leave something to luck and fate when you can decide the fate yourself? The reason you have a small groups of leaders is to prevent info from leaking, sure it would have been nice to know but what gives us the right to? We didn't spend hours on end planning and sorting out attack and defensive plans and all that follow with leading most of you only spent time playing your acc while a leader first spend his time fixing all the others problems and getting things sorted and then maybe he/she got some time to spend on their acc.

    You can point fingers and accuse all you want but in the end its not their fault all other alliances turned out to be quitters or noobs, they planned for the worst and hoped for the best well we got boring but nonetheless the alphas did a wonderful job just think of how many of you would have lost so much more if it wasn't for the leaders and officers analysing all incomings to separate the fakes from reals so yeah you can blame all you want but they still did a good job, if you don't like it there are plenty of other servers to play on but I can assure you, it will be hard for you to find an alliance that have the same quality leaders...


    razor out
    Quote Originally Posted by herbalmessiah View Post
    I hope you realize you will never win an arguement with silent wind. You may think you can, but you can't.

  7. #7
    Thorned Warrior
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    Oh well, I expected that there would be people who would just not get this thread.

    @ Dreamworld: you basically summarized what has been written by various other posters in other threads before. While doing so you completely failed to see what hsarp wanted to say. Frankly, I find it a bit annoying that you wrote this essay of yours into this thread and did not put it in a separate one or ANY other thread where these issues are discussed at length.

    @ Caliban: you fail to see that hsarp is WILD with all her heart. There were quite many posts where she speaks for her alliance. She is a VERY loyal member of your alliance. One of these members every alliance wishes for. If she wasn't she would have done exactly what you suggested to do - she would have left or deleted. However, as a very loyal member she should be allowed to express her own opinion and feelings WITHOUT having to explain herself to anybody or even being censored.

    And now to the important point: hsarp does not question your ability to lead an alliance, or how you deal with diplomacy or conduct wars. She simply criticizes HOW the majority of WILD omegas dealt with the situation. Why did she not post this thread at the beginning? She was not really happy finding out that WILD and RED were in fact the same alliance, she felt somewhat betrayed but certainly she would have gotten over it and that would have been it. If the WILD and RED omegas had come here on the forum and said at least ONE SINGLE TIME that they actually felt sorry for how things had turned out, she probably wouldn't even have created this thread. Instead, every and I repeat EVERY thread on this forum is turning into a "he said, she said" game within a few hours. Every side is trying to make the other look worse, the importance seems to be who has betrayed whom more.
    A single line of admitting that the whole action was a bad idea would have done it (and I am talking to both sides). Instead, all energy seems to go into making your own side look better and you have the audacity to tell some of your members off for expressing their own opinion.

    Hsarp, that was a very brave decision to post here! Thank you.

  8. #8
    Natarian Knight Cappo's Avatar
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    Can anyone summarise all the walls of text above so I can ignore them and move on?
    ARM - S4 2007 - Cappo (Gaul - Defensive) / AoW - S6 2008 - Cappo (Gaul - Defensive)
    AoW - S1 2009 - Ghost17 (Teuton - 529,517 Off. Points) / Exile - S6 2010 - Fern (Gaul - 1,001,050 Off. Points)

  9. #9
    Natarian Knight
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cappo View Post
    Can anyone summarise all the walls of text above so I can ignore them and move on?
    Just read the main wall - threads opening post and reply what you feel. Rest posts are irrelevant as some just try to steer this thread in the same direction as lately every thread is being steered at...
    There are three main tragedies in a man's world: 1) Life sucks. 2) Job sucks. 3) Wife doesn't.

  10. #10

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cappo View Post
    Can anyone summarise all the walls of text above so I can ignore them and move on?
    hsarp most likely dont have any alphas on skype so he went on the forum to cry and seek attention, someone responded then caliban responded and i responded and saurkraut said something and then u came here and then fleg said something and now im replying
    Quote Originally Posted by herbalmessiah View Post
    I hope you realize you will never win an arguement with silent wind. You may think you can, but you can't.

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